Community Game: Rules & Mechanics

[Ripplez]

a higher communication requirement is a luxury not the norm. its not like pokemon, characters and spells and stuff dont all have higher levels of power to unlock. just a few. theres also the fact that communication will probably drop during runs and things. it also might be a resource for the opponent to attack. its not the norm to have or need high communication but it does help and it should be reflected as a powerful resource not a dime a dozen stat change. theres no need to raise it for most cards, the number of cards that would need a higher communication would probably be like 5%. the numbers of cards that would refer to communication at all would be like 33% and those cards would be powered down when the comm drops during events, which is another aspect of the value. maintaining a higher comm value works there. communications isnt some stat to make half the cards irrelevant. its take make a few cards in the minority much stronger with some effort

heres a closer effect : At the beginning of your upkeep, if you control five or more lands, put four +1/+1 counters on Scute Mob

except that five lands is normal in a game of m:tg. getting additional comm. needs extra cards to get out. scute mob doesnt obsolete every card that doesnt work like this. but its a good solid card. also the literal keyword threshold. didnt obsolete everything else even though it was a very strong mechanic. except that here it has more than one direct use

[aardvark]

So what kind of card do you think would work like Scute Mob with the communications mech?

[Ripplez]

in a system where base faction comm is taken to be 5 and clan comm in runs is 0

merchant spy : ally
cost 4
life 2
combat 1
tinkering 4
comm diff 3

comm diff 3 : when your opponent plays a card during their defense phase, you may draw a card then select one card in your hand and put it back on top of your deck
comm diff 6 : when your opponent plays a character or artifact card during their defense phase, you may draw a card


forged orders
clan card
cost 3

comm diff 6 : dismiss one of your opponent's allies to their clan area

mercenary leader
ally
cost 5
life 3
combat 3
tinkering 2
comm diff 4

comm diff 2 : target character card exhausts this run
comm diff 4 : when your opponent plays a trap card this run, you may put a ally into play with the keyword 'Dismantler'. sacrifice it at the end of the run


need to find a system wherin clan comm is stronger the bigger the number but comm from a card must be lower or equal to succeed a check. and if we use a run = less comm system, then a way to have that make sense too

[sneaselx]

I would like to make a motion to have no more than five card types. With this large, complicated game, it there are already many different cards, with drastically different timing, etc.

Maybe we could combine multiple types into one, seperated by a keyword and some text?

All Current Proposed Types:
Avatar
Ally/Character
Location
Trap
Document/False Document
Faction
Clan
Machine
Resource

Which of these is necessary? Which ones can we merge? Which can we get rid of?

[Ripplez]

faction is avatar already

i dont understand machine. can resources be machines? like steam engines or clockwork mechanisms or thing?

you forgot skill cards. not even my version fo skill cards but essentially the sorcery/instant card type of the game

yeah, i dont think its going down to five maybe we should first figure out what the game will be like before trying to figure out how many card types therell be. and really, having more than 5 isnt necesarily a bad thing

[aardvark]

Yah, makes sense. Slim the list down a bit.

faction is avatar? you mean clan?
Avatar is YOU, the player, a unique Ally card with stats higher than normal.

Clan becomes just Faction. Maybe it just me and semantics but Faction seems more appropriate Fluff-wise.

As I recall "character" was just the term used to refer to all of the people type cards. ie Avatar and Allys.
While machines was never a mandatory user-voted idea, it could be used to include Traps as a sub-part. ie. Devices - Traps sorta deal.

Resource cards will depend on whether or not we use actual cards to determine how many "resources" we have.I know that what I suggested what purely abstract. No actual cards used to determine how resource rich the player is. Ripz listed Resources under the cards types included in her decks. But I'm not quite sure about you, sneaselx. Looking back at your post I can see this going either way. It seems that Ally cards would be able to generate resources but you also mention playing resources. If you would please clarify, that'd be great. Unless you meant it both ways.
Of course, like I said, whether or not resources are actual cards / card types depends on our final iteration of the gameplay / mechanics.

So...

characters (Avatar and Allys)
Location
Document / False Document
Faction
Machina - Traps / Equipment / Weapons
(Resources?)

Without resources as a card type, we can easily trim this all down to five basic types. And imo resource cards are not a necessity in a card game. Suggestions? Feedback?

[sneaselx]

faction was a card that would designate init stats, similar to avatar.
From what I read, I thought clan cards basically were skill cards. (like clan commands.), though I may be mistaken.

In my post, there were two resources: Info and Water. Water was generated by some machines, and also used by other machines. Info was generated by allies, and could be spent to initiate a run. Machine were basically permanents that provided some constant effect, which was in contrast to traps, which did nothing until activated.

It seems to me that Faction should be implicit in how you build your deck, not a card in itself. If allies belong to a Faction, building a deck around a Faction card basically means the same as building a deck around those ally cards.

I prefer a cumulative init, where several cards you choose set up the game. For example, instead of having a Faction that says: "Start with 5 resource X and 12 resource Y.", have an ally that says "Increase starting resX by 2 and starting resY by 5." and an equipment that says "Increase starting resX by 3 and starting resY by 7 if all your allies belong to FactionA"
Some cards could increase starting values, but would have weaker game effects, meaning you had to balance between good effects and a good start. It would also mean you would have more control over your decks performance, as you wouldn't be limited by what Faction cards exist.

Never mind, got the chip off my shoulder.

Also, should the focus be on the run itself, or on the setup?

[Ripplez]

why not both?

[sneaselx]

Been working on a possible ruleset based on combining the three pitches. I tried to use the strongest ideas from each pitch, and common terminology. If you think any part of it is not perfect, just say so.

---------------------------------------------
Syncretic Game Idea

Character:
Name
Type (avatar or not, etc.)
Cost (If not avatar.)
Spy Stat (Used to avoid guards/ spot spies. Combined Intel/Conceal)
Loyalty (The difficulty of turning this unit. More later.)
Effect[Communications Difficulty]
   
Location:
-Cost (Pay in order to put into play. Usually not large. May be free.)
-Types (2 or more. Used as Prereqs for various things.)
-Size (Maximum number of Allies or Major machina allowed. Includes traps.)
   
Document:
-Name
-Name of Machina. (All Major machina require documents. Some Minor machina, also.)
-Other effect[CommDiff?] (May be used for other things, including bad effects.)

Skill:
-Name
-Type (Clan, Spy, or Neutral)
-Cost (Pay to play.)
-Effect[CommDiff]

Machina:
Name
-Type (Major, Minor, or Trap. Major represent buildings and vehicles, Minor represents
equipment. Major machina MUST have the appropriate face up document in play.)
-Cost (Required to play.)
-Traps:
Traps also have several prereqs for spies to pass them. These can include having
certain keywords, paying a specific resource, or tapping a card. They also have
an activation penalty, for when a spy fails the prereq.
      
   
Faction:
-Starting Resource Number (epecially useful for setup)
-Communications Value
-Defense (How many Spy cards you can draw to defend your base.)
(May only have one of this card.)
Init:
::Two Decks:
One deck contains allies, locations, documents, and machina. Basically,
anything you need to setup your playfield. (clan deck)
      
The other deck contains allies, skills and machina. (spy deck)

Each player draws five cards from their Clan deck, and
can set up their playfield. (Needs at least one location, and
one doc.) Then, return the rest to your Clan deck.
Each player puts their avatar on any location they control.
   
There are two playfields, clan and spy.
:Clan includes locations, documents, and Major machina. This is where you defend against enemy runs.
:Spy includes allies and equipment. Locations are not played in the Spy playfield, but allies in the
spy playfield are still affiliated with a location.
{Skills can be played either place, depending on type.}
{Only allies in the Spy playfield can enter a run, and only allies in the Clan
field can defend a run. Once per turn, you can change one ally to another playfield.}

Phases:
-Start Phase:
Untap all cards. Then, you may move one of your allies between playfields.
-Action Phases: (flow according to Rippelz rules.)
-Clan phase: draw cards from your deck according to your Defense value. You may
play as many of them as you want. After your turn is up, discard them.
      
--Spy phase(Prep): You may draw cards from your spy deck equal to your communications. Use
these cards to prepare.
--Spy phase(Run): This part of the Spy phase is optional. In this part, declare an opponent's location.
you enter the trap portion. All traps at that location are revealed, one by one,
and your spies have to deal with them by passing the prereqs. If you fail, your spies will be weakened.
Both players may play any Spy skill if the timing of the skill is correct.
Add up all your allies' Spy value, and compare it with your opponent's cumulative Spy value.
If you suceed, all documents at the target location are yours.
-Resources: Water is generated by some Major machina, and is required as upkeep for other machina. Some machina may also
convert Water to electricity (Sparkies Faction) to run other machina. Water is used to play physical cards.
-Influence allows skills and additional allies. Influence is generated by tapping allies in you Clan playfield.

-Allegiance: Instead of generating resources, you may tap an ally to put one counter on an opponent's ally.
If the counters on the ally are greater than its Loyalty value, you take control of the ally, and all counters
are removed.
------------------------------------

Note:
I did get rid of having a permanent hand completely. This may be controversial, and the wrong move. It's just the way that seemed most appropriate to me at the time. Anyone with a better way, just say it.

[aardvark]

Wow. That's really well put together. You did a good job in combining everything.  It's minimal and not overly complicated. Kudos eh.

I'll go with this unless I hear any objections. *crickets chirp*

I'm all for it.

[Ripplez]

where are machina and documents stored till they are used in a way that ensures that they ARE machina and documents - but doesnt reveal what they are? if you put them in the clan deck, how will you guarantee your opponent has something to make runs for? sorry i didnt catch that in the outline you gave

is it possible to score documents you control yourslf? its not important if it isnt, just wondering. it would change the flow of the game,

why does it use a temporary hand? what if you wanted to respond to something your opponent did on their turn? if your using my phase alternation, remember that these alternate phases come during each players turn, the only diff is who gets to decide the order. so it would be alot more disadvantageous if your not the turn player because you wouldnt have any sorcery/instant level cards to play, just using the effects off of permanents. i dont mind if you dont want to use the phase alternation as a result

if you explain the points i just mentioned and theyr ok, then i have no other problems. everything else can just be worked out later, this would be good enough to get started

[sneaselx]

1. Documents are initially placed face down at the location. Major Machina cannot be played at all until the appropriate document is face up in play. Traps are played face down on or around a location, but separate from the documents. Minor Machina are just played equipped to an ally, or whatever depending on their effect.
In order to make sure you always have at least one document,(or something your opponent thinks is a document.), you have to play at least one in the beginning of the game. However, as you need them in order to build a decent economy, you are encouraged to play more, unlocking more choices.
2. I don't know. Actually, looking at it again, it seems I forgot a way to win entirely. Woops.

3.I used a temporary hand mainly because it turned out that way while I was trying to interpret the phase structure of your post. Feel free to rewrite the phase part, by the way. What if, to fix the lack of instants, you could play card from you temporary hand into a permanent hand. They wouldn't be allowed to be played for a while, or would cost resources, or something, but you could activate them quickly.

[Ripplez]

the document thng might need to wait till theres a way to win. without a way to win, how the documents will be implemented seems hardt o do

why not just have the instant speed stuff be based on card type? that way cards meant to be played during a phase are playable and things that can be played in response can be played in response

[Ripplez]

why dont we just have the documents shuffled as part of the clan deck and drawn with the hand. they can be played as documents facedown or faceup in locations. it also helps introduce the ambiguity over whether or not its a document or a trap. the win condition could be to take the documents with documents stored in your lcations giving like 1 victory point a turn

and i still say let spell speed be baased on card type

[sneaselx]

I don't understand what you mean by spell speed. If you mean having seperate card types for when different cards can be activated, it is because I felt that many different card types was redundant. But its not my game, so yeah.

I think putting documents in the clan deck is a good idea. Unless anyone disagrees, I propose that is now how they work.